I have had the desire to run a magical academy game for a long time.  I've tried several times in the past, with D&D, and had very mixed results.

I've been thinking through how to make it work out, and I am sort of stuck between which would work better, freeform or D&D?

freeform promotes creative writing and tends to draw players more looking for story than mechanics.  It would also allow me to tailor the setting to be what I want it, mix in whatever I feel like.
But the lack of mechanics would make it hard to really define what spells/magic the characters are learning.  There's no way to feel accomplished, growing in power, aside from describing it in creative text, which doesn't seem as concrete.

D&D on the other hand has a very thorough system to show magical abilities, a growth in magic, and gaining wider capabilities.  But it also draws more of a mechanical bend to players and games, with characters designed to fight, not to be social.  It would also be hard to go through a growth of beginner magic user to powerful practitioner without sort of fast forwarding through some of it.

(Just to clarify my current idea for a magic centered academy game in D&D is centered on the Arcane Congress in Eberron setting.  I am thinking allowing characters as 2nd level gestalt, with either wizard, sorcerer, or artificer as one side of the gestalt.  I figure this would allow for a wider variety of characters and capabilities.

Then splitting 'classes' between spontaneous and learned arcane magic, with various instructors teaching different things.  Maybe have some sort of exam or test that would be more of a puzzle combat experience to gain xp, allowing players to level up and also take lessons.)

Which system do you think is more appealing?  any idea how to counter some of the problems I have described?

Why not do both? Run it as a freeform game but use the constraints of D&D to define what characters are and are not capable of when it comes to magic. If the goal is to have a game centered around the social aspects of a magic academy while still having defined limits and trackable progress, this seems like a good compromise.

Is there a reason you're so interested in D&D over other potentially more narrative focused systems?

I would be willing to look at other systems, but I do not know of many that have a similar style of fantasy magic.

I think you're selling players of D&D short, here. Anyone can make a social character in any game, if they're willing to actually RP the character through 24/7 life instead of just rolling dice when the GM throws a combat encounter at them. You just need players that want to ROLEplay instead of ROLLplay.

As for fast-forwarding, that's normal for any system - even free-form - if you want the characters to have a massive jump over a short period of time. More XP = Faster growth.

I suppose finding those specific players is the difficulty, because I have run over a dozen D&D games on this site and that has consistently been an issue, in comparison to other systems and freeform.


so, no, I am not selling players short.  I am describing my experience on this site, with these games, including multiple attempts to run a game very similar to the one I have described.
This message was last edited by the user at 22:54, Sat 08 June 2019.

I think OutlawJT nailed it.  Straight freeform will see people trying to tackle different power levels differently.

What version of D&D would you be using if you go that route?
This message was last edited by the user at 20:27, Sat 08 June 2019.

While there have been versions of D&D that had trouble keeping both role and roll as relevant components, but 5e isn't one of those.

Assuming you plan to use 5e D&D 2nd level Gestalt should work just fine for 'adult students' in the wizard and sorcerer classes, if you plan to include warlocks or bards then 3rd level may be a better plan so they can start out with their subclasses at least picked out.

One of the biggest draws for me would be to see new or unique spells. Would you allow the occasional third party or home made spell?
This message was last edited by the user at 21:32, Sat 08 June 2019.

Hm...I kind of worry that D&D would be a bit too constrictive to be honest. I mean, you're literally talking about Gestalt characters that will have a whole extra class worth of abilities? And everybody will have to focus on learning very specific spells that might not give them what they want to do, and there'll be whole swathes of stuff you probably won't be interacting with much.

Personally, I would suggest a more freeform method where people can still learn specific spells or levels abilities, but they'll also have clear limitations. That way you can still have pseudo mechanical progression, but can create whatever spells you wish and have people advance in ways they find exciting.

Not to mention that even 1st level characters (let alone second level Gestalt characters) are already, well, powerful characters. They'd hardly seem like students.

I once played a 12th level character who's background was as an advanced apprenticeship training as a war wizard of cormyr.  There are lots of kinds of students, they don't all have to be ignorant 12 year olds.

5e D&D has plenty of versatility to manage picking skills.  Particularly if you push the game in a wizard direction.  Alternatively you can add a 'learning' component to spells rather than just transitioning from unknown to known suddenly.

I think however the point isn't to learn how to make the magic turn on, it is to learn how to use the magic properly and efficiently in specialist circumstances.

Honestly, I have no experience at all with 5e D&D.  If I used the idea it would have been 3.5.

I guess I'll have to think on it further.  I'd still be afraid people would do sort of what you just described, join just to see how powerful mechanically they could get, what abilities they could get to.  D&D games always seem to boil down to crunching the mechanics, trying to max power or ability.

Players aimed at that tend not to care about talking to other students, or learning about the fluff of the game as much.

I mean, especially if you aim for a Gestalt game...that's mostly what you're going to get. I might recommend trying to find a different system to help with what you want to do, or do pseudo-freeform.

I think there's enough variety to choose from that Gestalt wouldn't be necessary.  Bring the focus more your character's style/personality and flavoring or reskinning magical effects.  I think as soon as someone goes to make a gestalt character they starting thinking combos and mechanical synergy.

I sort it see it the opposite, but that may be why this idea won't work well in d&d.  Low level wizards tend to all be the same, players don't go for flavor as much as what works best.  Which may be the core of why I should aim for freeform.


Any ideas on how to make a freeform game where progressing in magic knowledge feels rewarding?  Or another system with a detailed fantasy magic aspect?

Unfortunately, no.

Maybe strip away all the mechanics, and simply let players choose from a certain number of spells from each level with one or two higher level spells that are their focus or specialty.  Or a minor school of magic feat/ability.

Only let PCs gain new spells or feats if they play it out in character.  Some might focus on many weak spells, others a single higher level one, and others may go for a feat that allows them to use one particular spell in a unique way.

How many players are you looking to get? If it's a smaller group 4-5 then, like I said variety shouldn't be an issue with a single class.  If you are wanting a group of 20 or so, then I start to see your point.