I hate-hate-hate colored speech text.  Why are quotation marks not good enough?  I don't need colored speech text for books, why should I need it for roleplaying?  It makes me feel like I'm reading a MySpace page circa 2001.  And the effort it takes to go in and color-tag all the speech in a post is just annoying, especially when it's broken up into smaller parts, as my character's speech often is.  Not to mention the hassle of editing your post once the color-tags are in place.

It's just a headache.  Why do people love it so much?  I just don't understand.

Personally, when I read a response or reply from someone I find that if it isn't in coloured text I just take it as a thought. But when it is in colour it highlights to me that they are talking. However this could be just because I'm used to it, as when I read a book its different.

Also, I don't go back and edit it in. I usually type it as I go, saves a lot of time for me like that.

If it's in quotes, it's speech, right?

For me, especially as a gm, it allows me to see what is speech easier when sifting through long or numerous posts.  It's great for players to give details on what their characters are thinking or feeling, or exactly what they are doing.  But if I need to write multiple NPC responses, it really helps to be able to easily see exactly what is being said.  I think it also helps to be able to give different colors to different NPCs, to let players differentiate easier.

In reply to Machiara (msg # 3):

That is how I always assumed.

I typically only use color speech voluntarily if it's to denote more than one speaker in my post.

Doesn't bother me, I figured it is so you could pick out speech easier from actions and thoughts.

Then again different gms have different rules on speech and thought colours.

I'm with Machiara on the whole "coloured text for speech" thing - I don't see the point in it. Books don't have different colours to show you who's speaking, they have the speech in speechmarks and a suitable description to inform you who it is who's speaking. I find coloured speech just irritating, really.

I embraced it when I seen others were doing it. While I don't mind in general reading a book without it. The site itself, and especially if it is a long post. It is sometimes difficult to read everything the way it is there with some of the spacing. So the color does really help, and sometimes tells my brain that this is stuff I need to focus on a little more. Sometimes if it isn't there, the speech can blend into everything else for me.

Unfortunately for either side of this, it is a preference of the person typing it out. As a GM though, you can request that someone not use it in your game. But that is really the only thing you can do. I was thinking for a moment there was an option to turn that off for your side at least, so you don't have to see it. But I think I am thinking of another site or something else.

Books do not do it because colored ink is more expensive in both material and labor.
Whether I agree with it or not, that is the reason why books do not do it.

As a GM I use the colored text to represent different people talking within the same post. As I am not a literary genius the colored text is a tool that simply replaces a form that has been used in years.

This
Post by Bob: "I think I'll head to the store."

is the same as
"I think I'll head to the store." Said Bob

No different
This message had punctuation tweaked by the user at 23:57, Sun 01 Feb 2015.

Well, apart from the fact it's in colour and is therefore kind of distracting...

In reply to Mrrshann618 (msg # 9):

It depends on the game. I dislike it when people use coloured speech instead of proper grammar. Even in your example, I would want the player to write out, Said Bob whether or not they coloured their speech. Because I read a game like I would read fiction.

I don't dislike it, necessarily, except that it can be a pain to add in all the tags.

I've never really understood the point of it though. The only reason to emphasize dialogue over actions/thoughts, is if you think the speech is more important. I do not think so.

I don't find it the least bit distracting.  In fact, I rather like it.  It helps my poor ADHD-distracted mind keep things better organized, and it helps make things jump out at me easier if I need to remember what Bob had said - I can more easily skim down and just look at the red text for Bob's speech whereas Joe's is blue and Tom's is green.  It makes it a lot simpler for me, and it tells my brain, which is constantly trying to distract me and itself, that I really need to pay attention there.  Quotation marks just don't do it as much because of all the other punctuation in posts.  They just blend in.

Because I don't need to remember speech in a book as well as I need to when actually interacting with other players on a web site, it's not a big deal to not have colored speech in a book.  But when it comes to taking notes when reading medical books, I highlight.  If I need information on one of my medical problems and I get it from a website, I print it all out and then highlight or underline with colored pens the relevant information, doing so in very small chunks and several re-reads so I don't miss anything, so that I can then go read the entire thing and focus on what I need to focus on to help me retrieve the information from my brain later.  That doesn't mean speech is more important than actions, tone of voice, body language or facial expressions, but it does mean that my character's verbal response(s), if any, definitely needs to also take into consideration what was said.  Plus it just helps break up a lot of text for people with learning disabilities or other issues like those on the now-redefined autism spectrum.

As an educator (who dearly loves working with special needs students), a sufferer of ADHD, and the mother of a child with ADHD and Autism, I can tell you that what works for some people will drive others crazy.  So while you might not like colored text, it can really help other people and vice versa.  It allows me, for example, to give my best to the games I am in, and that of course means also to the GM and the other players.  Maybe those colors that bug you so much are helping me or other players in your games be better players which is good for you.

So worst-case scenario, color or no color bugs you.  Is that really a big deal?  Are children going to starve over it or have to bathe in their drinking water because of it?  It's just something to deal with in games where the GMs request or allow color.  When you're the GM, request no color.  But for the sake of players who might really benefit from it, and remember that the entire game and all people involved would also benefit, please allow it if it is requested.  However, it's your game, so ultimately it's your right to do what is best for you.

Best-case scenario - realize that it's really helpful for some people and be glad that they have a tool in their arsenal that can help them overcome what can be an embarrassing and detrimental issue in their lives.

This is just my opinion but I like working with the colored speech. It helps distinguish speech from regular exposition, especially if one's sight isn't the best.

I'm not really sure why you'd need to distinguish speech from any other text, though. Surely descriptive stuff is just as important as what someone is saying? And...just look at the beginning of each paragraph for speechmarks...

If my character is Bob, I'm not going to say/post "Said bob". You already know it is me by the title of my post.
If you read this like fiction, and it is done in a post format from the POV of the character posting, it is not needed to add a subject unless you are referencing someone else. This would make "Said (person)" completely redundant.

I read these, as a GM/player, as if I were reading a script rather than a story. The Color replacing the speaking while the black is referencing actions or thoughts.

Definitely not saying I'm right, as it is all a matter of perspective and preferences.

Speechmarks?  I am going to assume you mean quotation marks.  The problem with that is quotation marks and speech are not always and shouldn't always be at the beginning of paragraphs.  Sometimes speech should be in the midst of or at the end of paragraphs, and that can create problems for people with all kinds of learning disabilities and other issues.

And as I explained in my original post here, speech isn't necessarily more important, but it does need to be categorized differently and responded to differently.

I like colored speech, and I use it, and plan to keep on using it.  :-)

Different strokes for different folks.  I don't join games that require colors for speech, but nor would I join a game that requires I not use it.

I hate anime pictures. *shrug*  But, yanno, in the scheme of things, it's pretty small.

In my games I do prefer to use colored text for our dialogue.

What's the reasoning for picking out a certain color for a character?

For some colored text for dialogue is for it to stand out from the rest of the post, most usually choose red or blue, but for others it's pretty random. Others like colored text for dialogue, because it makes things just easier to read especially with a long post. I agree and I've found for many it does tend to help readability somewhat here on RPoL.

I ask if a player is going to use 'Color Text' or 'Formatting Text' these are my recommendations, they are NOT a requirement but will add a new level of posting and understand to ones writing in a post.


This message was last edited by the user at 01:38, Mon 02 Feb 2015.

Exactly. The 'Said Bob' is redundant, techinically, but leaving it out would mess with the way I enjoy games. Much like people who use colour instead of quotation marks and commas and such.

Like yourself, I'm not saying I'm right. That's just how I like to play.

Bears mentioning that I don't actively dislike coloured speech. I'm in a game where I have to use it, and I do. And I'm in a game where I don't have to, and I don't. And in the two games I'm running, I neither encourage or discourage it, and some players use it and some don't.

What drives me a bit mad is when players use colored dialogue and/or italics in place of quotation marks.

So this:

The orcs are coming!  Run!  Bob grabbed his sword and dived out of the open window.

Instead of this:

"The orcs are coming!  Run!" Bob said, grabbing his sword and diving out of the open window.

Sometimes speech tags are useful, and sometimes they aren't needed, but they do tend to be clearer.

I don't really like the "Bob said" all the time.  I suppose it is a case of are we emulating sitting around a table playing a game, or writing our own personal book snippets.

That is easily fixed.

"The orcs are coming!  Run!" Bob said, grabbing his sword and diving out of the open window.

"The orcs are coming!  Run!" Bob shouted, grabbing his sword and diving out of the open window.

Bob grabbed his sword and dove out of the open window while alerting his companions.  "The orcs are coming!  Run!"

Bob grabbed his sword.  "The orcs are coming!  Run!"  In a flash he dove out of the open window with a fleeting prayer he would land on his feet and not on his head.

There are many ways to keep text and speech grammatically correct while also allowing for variety so that writing does not get boring and bogged down with he said, she said.  (And those are just three super easy ways you can vary up what is written.)

In reply to otghand (msg # 21):

Yeah. I've seen games where they write in 1st person, too. "I attack the orc."

Can't handle it.

You don't specifically have to say "so-and-so said" every time...just as you don't see that particular phrase used constantly in novels, you can change things around a bit and use different words and stuff without needing to use the exact same method os speech indication every time - if it's only two people who're having a conversation you can get away with not including any narrative description for a few lines once it's established which order they're talking.

Observationally, when I jumped into this thread I stopped scrolling to read the red comment, AND THEN read it from the beginning. I probably would have just read the last few comments and moved on, not having given personal input otherwise.

I enjoy colored text tho I dont require it in my games. It lets everyone have there own unique distinguishable mark.

I would rather have colored text, then a 400 word wall of text describing the mechanical process of eating a peanut butter sandwich while scanning the news paper. Complete with inner monolog about digestive pains.

The colored text just breaks it up and gives your eyes a place holder to rest while you make sense of everything

I prefer colored text (with quotes) because I tend to identify folks by visual cues rather than a tiny little name written of to the side and away from the text I'm actually reading. I can't tell the trouble I've gotten in because I didn't know who I just responded to.

I'm with Shannara and Lord Cal and DLH on this.

Colors aren't necessary in books because one person is writing it all. The author doesn't have trouble keeping straight what was said or done or thought so that another character can respond appropriately. He or she also isn't including instructions to the other characters.

As a GM, I use small+orange to denote OoC instructions/information to my players. I use dark blue in quotes to denote "NPC speech" and darkblue italics for their thoughts (though I rarely share NPC internal monologues. I ask that my players pick a consistent color in quotes for their "speech" and the same color in italics for thoughts.

When I'm reading through several posts, it helps me keep it all straight, especially since some people aren't great with proper punctuation and some tend to run a whole post into a single big block. It's easier to remind them about colors than to harp on grammar and structure.

As a player, I use color for "speech" and thoughts, differentiating with quotes and italics. I desist if asked by the GM, but find games without color-speech harder and slower to read and more likely to misconstrue.

Anything that makes it easier to get things right and less likely that I'll screw up is good for me.
This message was last edited by the user at 03:10, Mon 02 Feb 2015.

I think colored speech is a necessity here, not just for a single reason.

These are a few of my reasons, not in any particular ranking:

I can scroll through a post quickly to find the person's post I'm looking for (my own too). Often I'll read a thread, then have to come back to it later and respond with my own post. I remember Player A said something first, so I can go right to Player A's post with my mouse wheel. "Did I already say something, or was I only thinking about posting it?" I will often ask myself.

If I'm reading a book, I'm focused and relaxed and the narrative is (generally) consistent. When I'm reading/posting to a game, I may have 3 minutes here or there, not everybody is "on the same page" temporally, and players can have different ideas of what they want to do which may be contradictory. Anything that helps keep people straight in those situations -- without my having to reread carefully from Post 1 to reset the situation -- is a boon.

Some players are ... prolific. Over time you get to know for yourself whether their posts include information "of note" or if it tends to be rambling musings about their secret emotions and overanalysis of a situation. For those players, again with the pressed time, it's a boon to be able to pick out "what did they actually say?"

GMs can have a game post with multiple NPCs. Sometimes players have posts with more than one character even. Maybe they aren't professional authors, and the structure of a conversation might leave a bit to be desired. Another boon to understand the flow of a conversation when other cues might be ... lacking.

Very frequently, as the story develops, I find myself wanting to review what some character *actually* said to my PC, and sometimes in what order. Reviewing 12 sentences of Green colored text over the span of 2 threads is infinitely easier (for me) than doing keyword searches for that specific character, limited to the certain posts, and still possibly requiring me to read entire posts when I only wanted those few sentences.

I would argue that dialog actually *is* more important than any other part of a post, discounting combat mechanics during combat. Unless the game is one-on-one, spoken dialog is the primary way player characters communicate and built rapport.
This message was last edited by the user at 03:44, Mon 02 Feb 2015.

OK I read them all and can agree with some and disagree with some.  However it all comes down to personal preferences, if you do not like colored text requirements by the GM, then politely bow out when you learn of them.  Problem solved and your nerves are not irked, plucked or whatever other term you wanna use.  Just my 2 pennies worth.

I agree that, functionally, adding color to speech doesn't detract from the dialogue (and if it's good enough for King James and Geronimo Stilton, who am I to object?), but as a personal preference, I prefer typography to conform to printed standards.  Some players think that coloring speech automatically indicates that it's spoken, but honestly, I don't know if it's spoken dialogue, internal monologue, or a third-person narrative comment (granted, the last case is rare, but I've done it in games before (= ).  Please, folks, don't neglect the quotation marks.  They've worked hard to get to where they are today.  =)

Too, I object to using different colors to indicate different speakers or languages, although I grudgingly accept such conventions.  Perhaps it's due to my advancing years, but it's hard for me to remember if Timmy or Sue is using lavendar or if Sindarin is mauve or burnt sienna.  Using speech tags like "she said" (which is totes common in literature, y'all) makes things much easier to read.  One GM likes to use different real-world languages for fantasy languages, which is far more immersive than using red for Orcish.

One exception is for OOC sections.  Using another color for OOC lines is more gamish, I think, and helps distinguish the narrative bits from the rest of the post.

Ultimately, I don't have a problem with using color for dialogue, but I do find it unnecessary.

I simply see the addition of colour as a tool to be used, or not, if one prefers. The same thing as changing a font to show internal thoughts or as a substitute for telepathic speech. Personally I enjoy the feature and don't really see the use in hating on others using it. If it works for you than great, if not than maybe it is time to accept that another will do as they wish with their posts.

I do have to agree though, with not excluding quotation marks where needed. Not having that little keystroke does tend to make me think the speech is internal and not vocal. A second read through if need be quells that assumption though.

Not all of us like spicy food, but there is no use in calling people out on it or arguing that spicy food should not exist.

Personally, I like to think of colored speech as akin to stinky tofu or durian.  Yeah, it may be weird, but man, do people love it!  =)

I put up with it when others use it.  It's when the GM mandates that *I* use it that I find really annoying.

That's where we can make the choice of joining or not. It is their creation and maybe there is a reason behind their request to differentiate one's speech from narrative.

I like colored speech because it helps people (especially myself) more easily identify when my character is speaking, and thus also find something they may catch in one of my posts.  Sure, if you're always on top of things and responding to posts immediately, it may not be necessary, but when you're looking back through posts to find certain details of what was said, or trying to find something in the morass of posts that occurred when you were away for a vacation or, heaven forbid, post at a slower rate than some other people in the game (sometimes people think they need to post several times a day and you have to search through a page or two of posts to find what's relevant to your character), it just HELPS.

It's a tool.  One I personally use to convey a distinct voice.

I could learn dozens of terms to accurately describe the way someone sounds in my head and hope that everyone else hears their voice the same way I do, or I could put a COLOR on it and say "to heck with it, however you hear it in your head is up to you, but it's gonna be consistent, darn it!"

That way, you can do clever things like have a voice recording play and see if players pick up on the voices without blatantly saying, "Oh, it's this character, but you can't quite make it out so you aren't sure, but it sounds really similar!  But don't be suspicious now~" and instead leave hints and clues.  I've had perky characters use brighter, more energetic colors like pink and yellow, while darker, more broody characters use something like a dark purple, and hotheaded ones take something like a red.  Little ways to help convey their personality that don't require me to write a paragraph every time they speak.

I've gotten very used to the convention of each character picking a color for their speech, continuing to use entirely proper grammar, and italicizing their thoughts.

As a GM is is invaluable.  I can't tell you how many times I go back to a thread with 20+ pages, hit "show all" and quickly skim for a particular moment of dialogue that I am trying to remember.

Following a conversation is much easier if the back and forth is highlighted in color, and allows me to skim through to pick up what is happening.  Playing on RPoL is not at all like reading a finished book.  It is like reading a rough initial draft cobbled together by multiple different authors with no storyboard or architecture to guide them.

So, yes, reading through a published book, I would probably find it distracting to have the colored speech.  On the other hand, it might be completely awesome to read through a book with colored speech.  I don't know, I've never tried it.  Even in published books, if there is a lot of back and forth dialogue, it can sometimes get confusing as to who is saying what.

Purple was exactly correct when she pointed out that colored text is a lot light highlighting text.  After highlighting text you can skim through and pick out the most key elements, reading around the highlights to get the subtleties as needed.

I am also a GM.  I just don't see it.

My players don't use colored text.  I don't see how colored text would help me go back and find a particular conversation.  I can do that more easily just by looking at the player's avatars.  I don't need colors in the post itself because I already know who's making that post.

If I'm at the point where I'm looking at post content, it's just not very hard to identify the things set off by quotation marks.

I guess I'm in the minority here, but I'm just scratching my head at some of these responses.  I suppose if it makes things easier for you then knock yourself out.

When I started here,I didn't use colored speech.  I was fine.  Then I got into a game where the GM requested that each character select a color to use for anything they spoke aloud.  I was fine.  I'm now in a game where the default has become that spoken words are done in bold.  I'm fine.

I've used quotation marks in all of them.  Now that I have a phone that I can actually use to post online, sometimes I'll post from the phone and then I have to go back later and edit my posts to color/bold/italicize/whatever, because my phone lacks the '<' and '>' characters and if I try to use any of the formatting tricks at the bottom of the composition screen, it pops something up on my phone that covers my keyboard so I can't type.

It took me a little getting used to, initially.  I've been doing it long enough that the only time it really slows me down at all is if I'm posting in a different color (like, if I'm posting NPC speech), because I have to stop and think about what I'm typing.

And I'll say that, much as I found it awkward at first, I've come to appreciate it.  It makes it easier for me to keep track of what, in someone else's post, my character would actually react to...most of my games involve descriptive players who like to include little editorial comments about their tone, expression, or thought process.  I'm used to reading those in novels, they flow well in the game.  But I'm also used to reading scripts, and I know that what is said is often given far more weight than how it was said.  And in some cases, my character can't see the speaking character.  I don't have to hunt for the quotation marks to know what, from that post, is actually relevant to me in terms of creating a response.  It simplifies my process.

And, being in a game with a couple of players that seem to be disadvantaged when it comes to reading large blocks of type, breaking up spoken segments in color helps them make heads or tails of what's happening, because they don't see a wall of text anymore, they see short, manageable segments in different colors.

If you like it, use it.  If you don't, skip it.  If you don't care, go with whatever's working for everyone else.  If people are enjoying the game, you're doing it right...however that may be.

When you have hundreds of posts to sift through, looking for an address or name or some other tidbit of info even in dialogue a week ago, it makes it easier if that dialogue is a color inside a large paragraph.  If you don't agree, that's fine.  Not like we get paid or something if you do.

Coloured text for speech really is a preference thing. I prefer to see coloured text and quotation marks for speech, just a I prefer good grammar as I want to see a coherent narrative. But I don't get too stressed about it.

However, if you feel so strongly about it then there are simple solutions that don't require lots of wailing and gnashing of teeth.

As a GM, simply have a house rule about style. If players persistently offend after repeated warnings then eject them from the game. Harsh? Maybe, but it is YOUR game so you make the rules.

As a player if it bugs you then drop out and find another game...

Simple, right? And if you feel that either solution is too much then the speech issue doesn't bother you as much as you thought!!! :)

I am in the I-like-colored-speech camp for many of the reasons already covered by previous posters.

RPOL is not a book. RPOL users are not all experienced writers and editors. RPOL games are not written by one user who knows exactly where to take the reply to a comment.

I like coloured speech. It implies character in the colour choice (soft colours = tone). It draws attention to the speech and therefore to the thing you need to prioritise answering. It acts as a double reminder of which character has posted (you can identify at a glance).

It also helps when players do not use speech marks, do not use line breaks properly, or are liable to metagame where thoughts are tagged 'like this'('oh but I thought he said it aloud').

Seriously. I have met far too many people who WALLOFTEXT you with their speech in the middle of the paragraph. If their speech wasn't coloured I wouldn't be able to force my eyes to read it.

And finally, RPOL is not a book. It's a website. Different mediums use different tools. Books do not have mood music, dramatic lighting, or character portraits accompanying every comment. They don't switch perspective every few lines.

If it bothers you, disallow it in your games and don't do it yourself. But you might as well complain that your beef burger doesn't taste like bacon when you say RPOLers writing like role-players instead of authors bothers you.

These two points were the ones that basically came up when I started my first game as a GM. I asked the players what would help for formatting. My only real beef with Colored text is that if you are going to use it, use the same color for the characters your controlling. If Timmy used blue for 40 posts then all of a sudden starts on Dark Blue, that annoys me.

Using bold, Italic, or Underline for speech is the same gimmick as using color. It is simply a tool that allows people to quickly pick up "important" parts. From experience it is extremely helpful if I'm checking in with my phone during a long work stretch where i have no access to a computer.

I wonder why we pick up on dialogue as being so important.  In games I played around the table, yes, conversation was important, but what we did was just as important, if not more so.

I wonder why most games don't require actions to be in bold.  In fairness, I often use OOC or a private line to describe exactly what I'm attempting.  It's far easier to miss an action in a body of text than dialogue, even when dialogue is written normally.

I've been in games where people talk and talk and talk, and the GM finally asks someone to do something.

Yeah, dialogue isn't everything. I mean, if I wrote the following...

Bob scowls angrily at the roaring horde of orcs, drawing his sword with his right hand and hefting his shield in the other.

"Bring it." he says.

With no further word, he puts his head down and charges.

...I'd somehow think that the speech was pretty inconsequential compared to the actions ;). I only use colour in posts if I need to add an OOC note (such as a roll result or a mechanical clarification of my narrative actions in combat), which will always be at the beginning and/or end of the post.

In reply to Mad Mick (msg # 44):

I come from 35 years in theater as an actor and director. This all seems much more like improvisational theater to me than novels.

I tend to write speech-heavy posts, because that's what seems natural to me to express my character. Of course, when it's an action scene -- combat, chase, etc -- description dominates dialogue. I also use interior monologue to some extent, mostly to emphasize the dialogue or action.

I think some of this is dependent on the game you're playing. Most of the games I play and all that I run are character-heavy and mystery/mood-oriented: Call/Trail of Cthulhu, Savage Worlds, Deadlands. There are long periods of character interaction and investigation with short bursts of action. That makes dialogue more important.

I think free-form in particular, where the norm is long, dense posts, benefits from the colored-speech convention.

More action-centered games may not have the same need.

Machiara, I wonder what systems you run?
This message was last edited by the user at 14:36, Mon 02 Feb 2015.

In reply to Ameena (msg # 45):

I would suggest that it is because speech is used for communicating between characters. It demands attention in a different way. It's to do with the nature of communication itself. It demands you listen and respond.

I don't have to do anything about Bob leaping over the table or MarySue twirling her hair around her fingers for the forty-fifth time. I do have to present a specific response to either of them asking me to pass the salt, even if my response is to ignore them.

Well, not necessarily - you can ignore someone's words but wordlessly draw a sword on them if they dare to reach out and touch your backpack...

In reply to Ameena (msg # 48):

Yes, but if every post in your game involves a dramatic action like drawing a weapon or turning a hose on someone, you have a very strange game.

If you add up all the actions a person might take and all the times someone speaks without resulting in anyone listening, the statistics will agree that speech almost invariably demands our attention where body language and trivial actions don't.

I'm also not saying that I only read coloured speech, it just gives you a starting point for planning and preparing your reply. Like many people have said: it draws the eye in a similar way that hearing someone speak catches your attention.

On that note, I'd like to say something: I don't dislike coloured speech on principle (if a GM requires me to use it in their game and I like the game, I will use it without trouble or complaints), but when I'm GMing, I don't want to see it used, and this kind of mentality is exactly why.

If I make a post, including a sentence and a small paragraph describing my character's body language... then, about half the time, the words matters much much less than how they're spoken - which is what the body language convey.

See, here's an example:

The knight smiled.

"It's nice to finally see you, friend."

***

The knight scowled at the latecomer and spoke, his voice dripping with sarcasm:

"It's nice to finally see you, friend."

***

The knight smirked, emerging from the shadows as his enemy entered the room.

"It's nice to finally see you, friend."

***

Can you see the difference there? The character said the exact same thing every time, but the meaning of what he said is completely different, and each post requires a different reaction.

I find that articulating posts like this allows you to give much more personality to any character, but to get the full effect, you need to read and understand the full message that has been posted. I agree that the colored speech is eye-catching and grabs the reader's focus, but that's exactly why I am not really enthusiastic about it - because it encourages the player to just watch what has been said and answer quickly to that, without paying attention to the subtle meanings.

And while I agree that, if you're posting on the run, limiting yourself to reading and answering to the speech can be handy, I would always prefer for a player to not post, waiting to do it until later on, after having had the time to read it properly, rather than rush things and maybe break the immersion by ignoring important details. I recognize all the points that have been made about people liking coloured speech - except that to me, those are all reasons why I dislike it.

Don't get me wrong, I think it is a very neat function to have, it is useful for those who like the use, and colored text has plenty of others uses anyway that make it a useful function to have access to. I'm just pointing out that, while some people certainly have good reasons to like it, the position of those who dislike its use aren't any less solid.

It is, as always, a matter of taste and what needs your game and players have; I just wanted to make the point that what one might see as a feature, might eb a downside for others. That's all. :)
This message was last edited by the user at 15:33, Mon 02 Feb 2015.

I disagree that it encourages one to only focus on what is said and not the surrounding text. I would not focus solely on your neon orange hat when you walked into a room, but it would catch my attention first and inform my reaction to the other things you do.

For me, and I don't know of others. The color is only a flavoring for me. It shows me where the text is. It doesn't mean I ignore what the actions are, but I guess what I am trying to say is it is put into two different parts of my brain. I read the action, and that is placed in the back of my mind for when I read the words I hear them or imagine them in how they should be said because of the action.

In most instances at least in the games that I am in you are going to be replying back to what is said. That doesn't mean I ignore the actions, the color just helps for me split it up into two different things to look at when I am replying. I am paying attention to the whole thing, but when my eyes have to go back to read it is either looking for the black of the actions or the color of the conversation. If it is all black, it just takes more time to find that part of the conversation.

Like others have said, it is a matter of preference for everyone. Use it or don't, do not join games that require it if you don't like it. Everyone's minds work differently, so some things are easier for some then others in a specific way.

In reply to Egleris (msg # 50):

Every game that I'm in that uses colored text for speech also has players that use plenty of normal text to give inflection.  The color just helps you identify WHAT is said.  Some people have their hands full dealing with that much.

Some of us are much more adept.  We can process a massive wall of text, readily identify quotation marks and even figure out by context alone if someone is speaking, thinking, or typing.  But there's a significant percentage of RPOLers who have problems with that.

I'm more than willing to take the second or two necessary to put color tags on what my character says if it helps my fellow players process the post more readily.  It's not like someone's asking me to translate it into another language or figure out how to turn it into Braille...

But if I got into a game where the GM didn't want it?  Great.  No sweat at all.  I'll be happy to turn it off, because it's the GM's game and he makes the rules.  And if I don't like those rules...well, I'll either not join the game in the first place, or if it's too late and I'm learning about the disagreeable rule after the fact, then I'll ask to be excused from the game.

If colored text bugs you, well...I have friends who are annoyed by the fact that I drink lots of soda and frequently eat meat.  I have a lot of friends who drink as much or more soda than I do, and rarely eat anything EXCEPT meat.  They may occasionally express their frustration with others who don't share their tastes...but they don't let it get in the way of having fun with them.  And if their opinions about it are so strong that they can't have fun with some people...well, they just don't associate with those people.  It's pretty simple, really...

Here's a couple snippets chosen at random from The Fellowship of the Ring:



And



This is what we're given.  Notice how short the actual speeches are?  I play in games, too, where people give long-winded, multiple-paragraph speeches (and I'm guilty of doing so myself (= ).  Sure, in theater, monologues might be lengthy, but in books and movies, it's not common to have these huge bits of dialogue.

I mean, try it out.  Pick one of your games and read each part aloud.  Keep track of the time, and see how long people speak.  We do things in play by post that don't happen anywhere else.

I started out around the table, and our speech was actual dialogue.  No one spoke for thirty seconds, or a minute, or five, unless someone was giving a speech.  Even the GM didn't speak that long.  I moved to play by email, and that, too, isn't given to lengthy responses.

The closest thing I've done to PBEM is collaborative writing, where I write a paragraph, and then someone else writes the next, and then someone else a third.  The difference between PBP and collaborative writing, though, is that the POV continually shifts, so yes, I can see the similarities to improv.  My favorite stuff is typically books and film, so that's what I draw from when I approach games.
This message was last edited by the user at 08:07, Tue 03 Feb 2015.

Ah, but in tabletop (and interpersonal real-time communication, and even in scripts and novels), you as the writer aren't trying to respond to an earlier post and THEN try and add something to advance the story at the same time.  If FOTR had been written in a PBP format, speeches would have been longer.

(Additionally, it's disingenuous to compare a movie script to PBP posts...a movie script ONLY describes the dialogue and the bare minimum of actions, because the director is going to clarify all of those points over the course of shooting.  Same with theater...if a character doesn't specifically say it in the script, it's open for interpretation by the director.

Since the closest thing PBP has to a director is the GM...who has better things to do than go through and provide descriptive details to everyone else's dialogue...it falls to the players to 'color' (not literally, in this case) their posts with information about how they say something, what they do as they speak, etc etc.  Different medium, requiring specific conventions in order to operate smoothly.)

This does, however, highlight how those who come to PBP gaming from a theater/screenwriting background have different priorities, generally speaking, in the process of composing a post than those who come from a background as a novelist (as some of the earlier examples have included three words of dialogue and easily triple that many words describing action or tone).  I started out writing novels and short stories...then spent over 5 years working with a playwriting professor as his TA (when I wasn't one of his students). I'm still working on getting to the point where my writing isn't all about the dialogue...because that makes for a pretty dry read, after a while.

People have different approaches to it, based on what they're used to--either in terms of what they've written, or what they're used to reading.  But PBP has unique requirements...largely due to the fact that you're trying to move a story along at an accelerated pace and you aren't the only one writing it (other factors may come into play, but those largely vary according to the specific game in question).  I logged on tonight and in one game, my first post had to address details from four other posts between my last post and the one I wrote tonight--and it couldn't just answer questions, it needed to answer those posts AND add some momentum to the narrative.  I got it posted and had to write another post, less than half an hour later, that had another three posts to respond to.  In that particular game, I can't accomplish that with a short snippet of dialogue and nothing else...at least, not at this juncture in the game (there have been points where I've had totally relevant posts that consisted of little more than (Note: character name has been changed to maintain some vague semblance of anonymity.)

But when my character is responding to an operative in the same room that he's in, acknowledging a subordinate who's also in the same room, and maintaining radio communication with an associate who's currently engaged in combat, a lot has to be said, or else I have to spam with a bunch of brief posts.

This also happens to be one of the games I'm in where there are players who have a hard time processing a lot of text (one guy gets lost if he's asked to read paragraphs that are more than four lines long).  Coloring the dialogue, along with making sure anything that involves me addressing his character is done in short, easily-processed paragraphs, makes his game-play far more enjoyable (and, coincidentally, less frustrating for the rest of us because we aren't having to reinterpret every third post for him in the OOC thread.)

In reply to facemaker329 (msg # 55):



As a board president for the last 8 years in a theater company and a reader of scripts, producer of short films etc. And lover/ active member of the arts, your comment is not 100% correct and slightly reaching. It is not UNTRUE - that does happen in some cases but it’s not a standard (I would say less than 50% from my experience). Most scripts have notes with the vision of the writer, stag appearance, event queue etc. It's different for each writer and their style of the writting, and the director then adds or maybe even chages it based on his views. Exactly why the more the better the understand.

I have a whole list of comments about directors but that could be a thread of its known :)

Color Text can be used in a smart way, it’s like texting - I once use all caps when I replied and was asked why was I yelling. I had no idea what they were talking about until I started reading text etiquette. Still far from knowing it all, but I now only use caps to show emotion of being upset.

In reply to Mad Mick (msg # 54):

Also, Mick, those excerpts were probably said in mere minutes and were scripted in advance.

When I am writing a post, it may be my only chance to 'speak' for a day or more. In games where the posting rate is one a day (or even two a day) -- and I mean the reality, not the 'expected posting rate' which is rather like 'estimated miles per gallon' -- if players try to carry on that sort of sentence by sentence dialogue it would be tedious and stretch out the snippets you quote over a couple of days or a week, if Bilbo has a RL interruption.

And I'll quibble with the idea that "No one speaks for thirty seconds, or a minute, or five." My dear wife can hold forth for long minutes at a time (and frequently does).

In reply to Gaffer (msg # 57):

This is an excellent point. As a GM, I try to end every post at a place where it gives the players something to do. It's fine in a movie for two characters to go back and forth in quick succession, asking a short question, getting a short answer, but in PbP it would be excruciatingly long and boring.

NPC's have to give info is reasonable-sized dumps. And when they ask questions, I almost always have them ask a series of them, sometimes to multiple people, so that the responses can move the story forward.

Same goes for books, to a lesser extent. People make larger, more complex speeches in print than they do on screen or on RL. It's one of the places where the medium of expression influences the mode of expression.

I agree with the base point, though. in RL, almost no one (except wives) gets to make an actual, for real speech in casual conversation without being interrupted.

I'm surprised that nobody's suggest that people who don't like the colours turn them off through the creation of a custom RPoL theme.  It can be done in a flash too - select "Load colours from" at the bottom (after choosing your favourite theme), click "Grab them", then tick "Disable colouring in messages" and finally "Create!".

Presto, no more colours in messages.

...and jase wins the thread.

And I'm surprised no one has made the best argument: it's pretty!  =)

As always, jase is my hero.

In reply to jase (msg # 59):

You win.

Although, to be fair, if that actually surprises you, then you must have never been on the internet before.
:p

Jase, you are my hero.  :)

In reply to jase (msg # 59):

LOL nice, end this conversation. :)

Cool, I didn't even know you could do that :D.

Edit - Just tried it, then realised that it also means that coloured OOC text in IC threads is also converted to black, so that's no good. D'oh!
This message was last edited by the user at 23:36, Tue 03 Feb 2015.

In reply to jase (msg # 59):

I had to laud a bit here. I diligently read through the entire three pages of this thread, starting at the OP and wanted to post exactly this tid bit, only to see my post ninja'd just before my turn. So, yeah, lol.

I also dislike colored text. Mainly because I find it obnoxious and distracting from what the poster is trying to convey. I was very frustrated at first and required my players to not use colored text. Some people are very defensive of their love of colored text. :) so I found Jase's well prescribed method much more useful than nagging all my players when they would forget to not color their text. Plus, I hated the white background and base colors of the website. Which you can also change in your custom theme. As well as add a background image.

Ok, glad I got that out there, load off my chest. :)

Would be interesting if instead of tagging text as particular colors, we could tag them as "ooc" "parenthetical" "speech" that way ooc text can be colored, and possibly my favorite use of colored text (coloring parentheticals) , yet allow everyone to select their own theme. So one person could make all players speech the same as regular speech without affecting ooc, while another person could make everyone's speech the same color but different from their own, etc.

That sounds cool, though I have been in games where people putting their speech in colour neglect to use speechmarks, so that would just get confusing to someone trying to read it all in black...

The variety of players and their relative familiarity/use of punctuation provides a necessity for something to be used to offset speech.  Yes, I realize some people can not stand colored speech text.  However, I play in a number of games where some of the players do not even use commas or periods.  I have one player who has NEVER used any sort of punctuation except a single period at the END OF THE LAST PARAGRAPH.

This leads to absolute insanity in trying to read plain, black text.  Without colored speech text I would never have a clue what the character was doing.  Also, I like to keep things simple: quotes/red for speech, italics/blue for thoughts.  For me, I have visual difficulties as it is: and the offset makes re-reading an entire page very quick and easy.

In reply to GamerHandle (msg # 70):

It sounds like we more or less all agree to some extent or another. Colored text is a preference. People should use punctuation and propper grammer (exept when deliberately done wrong). It obviously does help some people keep things straight.

I found a way to fix my issues with it on my side, as pointed out by Jase. It saved me a lot of headaches, quite literally.

Gamerhandle, the problem you are talking about with punctuation and writing technique is an entirely different post. One I'm happy to discuss as learning to write is something I have been doing for a long time and will likely never master. And yes, that would be insanity and make it so I couldn't play with that person.

~cheers

I have to agree with the OP here. I just joined the site and am starting my first game. Some of the players are trying to get us all into colored speech to represent languages. It's distracting to read, an added hassle to write, and leads to lazy grammar.

People have said that colored speech allows them to pick the speech out easier. In other words, it helps them to better skim the posts. My take on that is: if the people I'm playing with want me to go through extra effort to make it so they can spend less effort reading my posts (and missing all the non-verbal stuff I've written) then why am I gaming with this person?

I've only written a few in-character posts as of yet. So far I've been adding color just to get along with everyone... but yeah. It's unnecessary work, a bad grammar practice, and (if you think of it as setting your post up to be easier to skim) kind of insulting. :/

I am a GM.

When I need to "skim a post" it is to quickly go back to a previous post and see what exactly someone said.  Oh, I remember that player 1 said something about that last month; better go back and check the post to be sure...

It is not laziness; it is time management.

If the GM asks for colored text for various things, understand it is because it helps us organize ourselves in whatever fashion we feel the need for, and not to make posting more difficult.

What jtc said. In face to face game, a GM or player may need to remember what happened a few minutes ago. In a play by post game, you have to remember what happened weeks or months ago, depending on the speed of posting. Add in that you may be in more than one game at the time, and all the drek that comes with living in the real world, and anything that makes posts easier to read, organize, and reference later is a Good Thing(tm). If you don't like it, there are plenty of other games out there, or you can always try running your own.

I have been on RPoL for eight to nine years.  I use colored speech.  In fact, I far prefer it.  As I have stated earlier in this discussion, I even find it necessary due to ADHD and health problems.  My grammar, punctuation, and spelling never suffer from my long-term use of the tool jase so wisely implemented in his wonderful site.

And as jtcbrown and srgrosse explained, it isn't for "skimming" over your posts during game-play.  It can, however, help people with ADHD, dyslexia, Autism, and medical conditions involving the eyes or blood vessels of the eyes to break apart and separate large chunks of text.  It can help them to organize what is being said versus what is being implied via actions, stated body language, and facial expressions.  And, finally, as jtcbrown and sgrosse said, colored text is an extremely efficient tool when previous posts, often from years ago, need to be 'skimmed' to jog a DM's or PC's memory.  For example, earlier today I needed to look back at a post written weeks ago to remember what room my character was supposed to go to.  Because we used colored text, I was able to look for the appropriate color to find posts by the correct character and, thus, find the speech text very quickly.  It saved time and frustration.  My post, of course, still had proper grammar, punctuation, and spelling.

I'm confused about how colored text impacts grammar.

It's a slippery slope argument, where someone claims that because you use the 'color speech' option; you become worse as a writer as you will develop a lazy habit of not using any punctuation.

You know, in all the games I've been in that had colored speech, they used all the proper punctuation, along with the colors. Colors don't make people stop using proper grammar. The people who stop using proper grammar just because the speech is colored were going to do it anyways.

I think the two topics are mutually exclusive. Grammar is a problem for a lot of people, myself included. The colored text is a different issue. I don't think writing in blue font means I'll have worse grammar, only that my text is blue and now you have to view it that way. Unless you turn it off ;)

As far as calling out dialog is concerned and referencing everything as a GM, I just 'archive' the thread and that puts the entire thread into copy-paste friendly format that I can search with ye old control-f. Plus I use a GM thread for important remainders.

Nevertheless, I still hate colored text... So keep up the good natured fight. :)

Note: darn you srgrosse you're a forum ninja.

Yes, I am sneaky like ninja!

EDIT: Also, if you have a thing against colored text, that's all well and good. Not every game has to be for everyone. Some people like it, some people hate it. If you hate it, don't use it in your games, and don't play in games that require it. Makes it quick and easy.
This message was last edited by the user at 02:37, Tue 24 Feb 2015.

I am in a game where colored text is a requirement and another where it is just used by the players, kinda like playing follow the leader.  Although it does not bother me to use it, the hardest part for me is place my cursor between the quotation marks on my tablet.  Fat fingers it is can be a pain.

Now hopefully something that will be taken with humor.  Of those complaining of bad grammar and punctuation, which of you have an English degree?  If you do not, you are not qualified enough to complain about it.  :-P

Since when has a lack of qualification ever stopped people from complaining?  *laugh*

While I've been a fan of colored text, overall, now that I've upgraded to a phone that actually makes posting a viable option, I will likely start cutting down on it, for the simple fact that my phone doesn't have the appropriate brackets to post the RuBB code to color my text (or do italics, or spoilers, etc)   I'll live...

If your phone can select text, select the portion of text then click the color choice box. It will change the color of the selected text instead of opening a text box.

In reply to facemaker329 (msg # 82):

Never.  LOL

In reply to DarkLightHitomi (msg # 83):

If it can, I haven't figured out how, yet.  I had thought of that (I've done it on my computer before)...but I have yet to find any method of selecting text to use that option.