So I'm trying to get the thoughts of others and ask why more people don't tend to use this rule set. It doesn't seem very popular but its free and fun and easy to user without a lot of rolling sometimes -

So I just thought I'd see what others had to say about it.

It sits in an awkward place. I happily use it for the right games and now I know about it I'll likely never run freeform again.

But I would only use it for something which I would otherwise run as freeform. I wouldn't use it for dungeon crawling or superheroes or anything where the development of special powers and skills is part of the game.

I suspect that freeform players would appreciate it, if you could get them to look at it. Some of them baulk at learning a system (although there isn't anything to learn in The Window) and some get offended at the idea they need to draw lines around what they can do.
This message was last edited by the user at 11:23, Wed 10 Dec 2014.

The Window is okay, but I don't find myself using it anymore. Generally, I feel like the things it sets out to do (rules light, descriptive characters, story-emphasized roleplay) are better accomplished and reinforced by other games, like FATE, Wushu, PDQ, and Cortex+, among others.

Some people find the Window's foreword to be kind of condescending and abrasive as well, but I see that as worth looking past if you like the system. As far as I know it comes from a different era of gaming, and that bluntness probably worked as a way to clearly establish what it was all about. I guess I can see how it might rub someone the wrong way, though.

Because the system does not matter, I am fully of capable of roleplaying my character no matter the system I use. And I find most people who play the window to be very pushy about the need to convert to an outdated system.
This message was last edited by the user at 06:55, Sun 28 Dec 2014.

It's not popular bacause it's not really as good as other systems you could use. Like above guys said it's basically just putting random number generation into your free form. If you like free forms then that's what you like and don;t want the restriction. If you like a system then you want somthing more substantial that the window (Fate, Cortex, etc.)

Keep in mind I scoff at the idea of playing the Window or a Freeform. So a little bias here but you did ask.

I just don't find that the ruleset models performance in the way that it claims it does. Increasing die codes is fine, but without multiple dice the probability curve doesn't flatten at all, and make everything such a toss up.

I have the same issue with the Cortex system, to a lesser extent.

And, like others have said, it's claims it's being all clever and narrative-y, but really it's just tacking numbers to a stable set of adjectives. I find it emphasizes some of the worst aspects of freeform and system play without modelling the better aspect.

I don't much like it, as excited as I was by the idea when I first came across it. And yes, the foreword is really condescending.

If I'm going for super rules-lite, my go-to choices are Aspect-Only FATE and Risus.

In reply to truemane (msg # 6):

I considered using windows for a game, but after thinking about it, I felt the rules did not sit well with the campaign. Maybe Fate, idk.

Aspect only fate? I know its a topic for another thread, but that just sounds weird.

In reply to Merevel (msg # 7):

Rmail me and I'll give you the link. It's basically what it says: you get your ten Aspects, and everything you do is keyed off of that and your Fate points. No skill tree, no nothing else.

I'm a big fan.

In reply to RotnSoul (msg # 1):

The simple answer is that there are better systems, and ones that are better supported. Aspect-only Fate/Fate Accelerated are one good example.

Fudge, the other part of Fate is generally the weaker part of it. You could always do Window Fate but I don't think any one has written an inclusion guide.

Thanks for answers I'll be checking out a few of these others options.

Never mind this post -
This message was last edited by the user at 06:21, Thu 11 Dec 2014.

Some of the negative comments make me a little sad.

Although I rarely use The Window - I find it works as a quick tack-on to other systems when they are at weak areas.

Personally, I tend to favor extremely rules heavy systems (Rolemaster being my favorite of all time.)  However, whenever I want to create a simplistic system or borrow some ideas; the window comes in handy quite well.

That being said, I can see why some people would feel it is weak and unnecessary.  But, if you want to delineate stats but feel that just using adjectives is too 'weak' of a method of describing, sometimes dice next to a skill-name works well for a lot of folks.  Heck, you don't even have to roll the dice.

I use the system and love it when I can get into a game that uses it. i find it gives enough narrative freedom to remain true to any concept, while also having enough mechanical crunch to satisfy my sensibilities and avoid the 'cops and robbers' syndrome conflict in freeform games generally comes down to.

I don't like systems that just roll one die. That gives a flat probability curve and I prefer more of a bell curve. That's one of the reasons I don't use The Window.

I tend away from rules-light, but when I do use rules light, I go with WARP. Which is also free.

I'm going to be running a campaign around a table pretty soon with some new players, including one player who is blind, and WARP gives me lots of flexibility, plus very few things that my players will have to remember. And it uses d6's so my blind player can use his d6 braille dice.

Also, I am put off by the tone of the Window. I was also put off by the tone of Burning Wheel.

I find the Window to be a fine system. Not really life changing, but good for what it's trying to accomplish. Its prime advantage for me is that it takes less than 5 minutes to learn. Most other rules-lite system I've messed with have nuances to them that take a bit more time to grasp. Of course those system tend to have a little bit more body and strategy to them, but it all boils down to what you want in a system.
This message was last edited by the user at 14:38, Sun 28 Dec 2014.

^ This.

Five minutes to introduce someone to the concept of Role-Playing with mechanics.  Yes, people can roleplay - it's unnecessary UndeadBob to point out that you can "role play just fine" [paraphrase; but, it's a neat way to get someone on board with the idea of rolling dice and attributes.  You can easily 'upgrade' them to a crunchier system shortly thereafter.  It's like trying to play Axis & Allies, you start the 5 year old with Chess, then Risk, then A&A.  If you jump them straight to A&A, mind melting ensues.

Thats actually not a paraphrase of what I said, you just took 4 words I said within a running a sentence and put quotes around it. I was more referring to the fact that the system does not really matter, and that most people who try to sell others on the window are rude and in your face about. Not saying anyone in this thread was thus, just my own personal experience with it when it first came out.

However when the window first came out I was all about it, it was a neat bridge between (shudder) freeform and roll-playing. Others have already pointed out the flaws in it, its outdated now and the bell curve of the dice (trooper6 stated as much) does not appeal to me.

As far of ease of teaching new players, that all depends on how good of a teacher you are I suppose. I've inducted new, and not avid, players using fairly complex systems before. However I also try to gather players around me that are highly functional, "dumber" players soon fade away in the games I've run.

But really this is all just my own opinon and/or experience. I feel the somewhat negative comments about the window in this thread are as important as the positive ones, because you can't just trust any one source of information in any piece of knowledge you are researching.

ahh the joys of written text vs. inflection in speech.


I was only recently (less than a year ago) introduced to it, and for a number of friends who are well-capable of comprehending the more crunchy systems, but just don't want to do so: it suited well. (Incidentally these were the same that despised free-form for whatever reason.)