Daww, that's sweet! I got back from Medical S*** Monday and find that someone understands whether or not they agree, at least they accept it, and it warms my heart I tell you! Warms it to the very core! :D on that note, I really wish emoticons worked on RPOL, but completely understand why they don't.

Frankly, I've tried the more idealistic approach, when I first started. I am more strict now, to avoid the headache.

Not quite so strict as you, mind, but I understand the reasons why you would be. Happy to warm the heart!

I am altruistic to the point of martyrisum at times, but it has only blown up in my face the one time. Other than that the worst I get is people who stop halfway through sign up.

I am not saying though this is some high standard that must be sheared to or I expect people to change their ways. I am just stating these are things I'm seeing a lot of and have a problem with.

It is an opinion and just as valad as others, I am not arguing here I am trying to clarify what I am talking about.

I really do not understand why every one always asumes that they are in an argument when a discussion starts.  But them again my brain don't work like most peoples do. lol Though my friends say my brain works the way they wish peoples brains worked. I would have to disagree to many thoughts at one going on up there, makes relaxing difficult at times and communication harder (on top or language problems!!!!) when you mind is like 5 run away trains of thought all out of control and jumping back and forth from one to the other. X.x

In reply to UnseelieLord (msg # 94):

The point I made earlier about it being a two way street still applies.  The RTJ process is also a chance for a player to decide if they want to game with a GM.  If the GM's requirements are too harsh, not well thought out, or raise any other kind of red flag for me, that's valuable info for me as a player.  I particularly avoid folks that want me to write a book of backstory in their custom setting and don't tell me what their timetable is.  I've been bitten on more than one occasion by a hugh RTJ getting rejected because the GM was using the oh-so-effective method of "first come, first served" for player selection.
This message was last edited by a moderator, as it was inflammatory, at 05:12, Tue 15 July 2014.

In reply to UnseelieLord (msg # 94):

Nice post.

The other thing is, of course, that most of the times, in the past, when I've put effort into helping players improve/revise their initially rather poor character concept, they've generally vanished without trace about three weeks or a month later.

Without so much as a, "So long, and thanks for all the fish."

Kinda put me off doing more than telling them the game is full and turning them away.

In reply to swordchucks (msg # 99):

You sir win.

The internet...or least the thread ....least so far.....   Eh. screw it.  That was awesome lol

Yah I have to agree most of the things I'm talking about I take as a sign of a bad gm, but like I said topics like this or that other such subjects need to be talked about or nothing will change on ether side of the equation

In reply to Azraile (msg # 98):

Your opinion is indeed valid, because this entire topic is entirely subjective. Believe me, I'm not treating this as an argument. I'm far more cruel and insulting when I argue. I would consider this more a lively debate of mutual opinions, some which share aspects and don't others.

bigbadron raises another good point, because I've dealt with that a lot too. If I'm trying to run a game, I don't have time to take a personal interest in one struggling player, just to have him disappear for whatever reason. That's time I'm taking away from players who deserve the attention, and the game as a whole.

Swordchucks, what you fail to realize is that I am incredibly comfortable giving out pictures of my most recent colonoscopy. I give that to all prospective GMs, whether they ask for it or not. I find it forms a really solid bond that lasts a lifetime.

But I do agree that the RtJ process is a two way street. Like my mentioned recent issue. Just as the GM I got into it with is justified in not wanting me in his game for whatever reason, I found a GM who I never want to have to deal with in a game for what I perceive as unmeshable personality traits. There are certainly behaviors that are counterproductive to a strict outlook.

If a GM wants you to write a fully fleshed out character, with a novel for a history, but gives you nothing to work with, and then criticizes you for it... well that's not really fair. Which is part of the reason that I don't mind getting a pitch for a character beforehand. Because I do demand a lot of detail as a GM, but I try to be sure that the players have all the information they need to do that.

I also feel your pain, Azraile, on the brain not working like other people. It's a chore just to get my brain to stop for any length of time. Having a ridiculously genius IQ is a blessing, and a curse, to quote one of my favorite neurotic television genius savants. And having a genius IQ comes with so many other social issues that can get so annoying to deal with, but are apparently just our lot in life. Alas, in the end, it is still nicer to be able to say that you are in fact a genius. I value my vast intellectual potential, and it makes it easier to contend with the rest of it. After all, I'd rather be a tortured genius than a blissful idiot.

I fell the other way at times, rather be like everyone else would be so troubled mentally buy all that I know of the world, and I would not have been so abolished through my life, nor would I have been psychologically abused as much with the lack of the ever present impossibly high standards that was exspected of like the 3rd or 4th smartest kid my school had ever seen. ( which really isn't that big a deal it's sticks ville I don't think the highest broke 200 as far as IQ goes.  I'm only like 147 or 174 yah big dice acne but I honestly don't remember but I am rather shire it was the 147).  It has been utter hell and I have multiple learning disorders which makes things a pain, but that just makes the psicologest and the people doing those inteligence test tell people that my test scores are much lower than they should be because the tests don't take account of such things..... Which only raises peoples exspectations even more redicolously high. They treat me like I got a 250 or something ....  Geez

That and the classes that I didn't have some brain disorder with we're sssssoooooooooo boring I set in the back and drew or went to sleep and still got As heck US school system is a joke, even the clases I have disorders with I could get Cs and Bs with out putting to much effort,  so I got to be bored and treated like crap by everyone for 15 years yay.  No ones that big a jerk in collage but it is still boring, the only reason I can't get through collage is the stress. I am incapable of prossesing it correctly anymore. The classes.... I got a high C with multiple missed tests (from being to stressed to go inside around poeopke that day) and generally sitting in the back playing with my game boy ignoring the class. I even was  passing English WITH the teacher judging my spelling and grammar. O.o before they told them they couldn't grade me on that and I sure fly had A+s on every other paper, and got a B missing tests and not putting much effort into it.

All that dose though is get people hating me or mad at me, I am such a waist they say or it's not fair some lazy apple like me is so 'gifted'. Meanwhile stiff like that has me darn near agoraphobic.... Er no that's being outside..... Whichever one is being around other people. And having nervous brake downs screaming uncontrollably in the car because I can't go inside to work/class.

And then there is the frustration of dealing with stupid close minded people. Which outside of communities like this born of geekdom is quite the magoritity of people. I understand most people seam a little slow to me when I start talking about the big brain things that interest me, but I got use to overlooking that, but the sure rediculasly large amount of poeople out there that are willingly and stubery ignorant (republicans.  Hehe, no but yah some live in there own little world where they believe everything there told by republicans and anything non-republican is liberal brainwashing and should be blocked out.  Eh u.u THOSE people) the kind who don't know what they are talking about, know they don't, and insist that they are right even if you who've there face in erifutable proof...... How can there be so many people like this?!?!?!?!?

How did a generation like this get raised ..... And then made an even more stibernly ignorant generation!!!!



Weeeeew. Ok I'm ranting and I'm going to shut up now

When a GM opens an RTJ they have only your application to figure out whether they want to play with you or not, and it is you they are trying to figure out. If there is anything wrong or missing from your RTJ or character then you have to accept it could be rejected.

There is no reason not to spell-check your RTJ. It doesn't have to be perfect, but
There's no reason not to take the time and check it for there/their/theyre errors.
There's no reason for your RTJ to lack information asked for in the RTJ/Rules threads.
There is even less reason for you to miss an adult age statement for an adult game since this is now an RPoL notice which appears in all adult games. If you apply to an adult game without including an age statement, then do not be surprised if the GM refuses to accept a second RTJ.

If you don't take the time to look your best in your RTJ then you have to be prepared to be rejected on that basis. "It's only a game" but you're applying to spend a lot of time with the GM and their players and to submit to their rulings. You have to convince them that they want you in.


If you get all of these things right, but your character concept gives the GM the impression you as a player are going to be a pain then fixing the concept won't work.



That said I will work with players to fix their concept and get them ready for the game. I don't hold an iron rule on spelling and grammar so long as it's correct enough to be coherent. I will sometimes even give a player who looks awful a second chance to submit a less ego-stroking character. But when you get enough problems with the players you thought were going to be cool people, why in the world would you let in someone whose RTJ makes them look like an applepie?

I also check if the applicant has old games and if they have threads like this one. Old games let me know if I like the applicant's style. Failed games tell me what some of their interests are and that they were willing to give it a shot. Community Chat lets me know if I am willing to be bothered with the applicant's pet peeves and attitude. Sometimes I find nothing, but I've never felt wrong for checking. When an applicant's name seems familiar before I've even read the RTJ, it's usually not for a good reason.
This message was last edited by the user at 10:57, Tue 15 July 2014.

Besides manually searching how are you suppose to tell what games some one was in?

I've not found any option to do anything like that.

Eggy was specifically referring to games they GM. That can be found by typing their name in the GM Name search field.

You can find out what games they've run by searching for their name in Wanted - Players, or on the main menu search.

To find out what games they played in, you can always try asking them.

Az, a piece of general advice is that you should never talk about IQ, especially your own.  IQ is a relatively meaningless number and most of the people that talk about it are kind of doughnuts.

That said... you're far from alone in being miseducated by the system.  The very smart kids tended to have it the worst (it took me years to unlearn bad habits from my challenge-free high school years).  Having disorders on top of that just makes it worse.   Heck, the amount of autism spectrum disorders in my family is staggering (I have it, both of my kids have it, and two nephews have it).

Having a disorder sucks.  The world, frankly, doesn't care.  It's not their job to care.  It's your job to rise above it.  I had always had trouble interacting with people conversationally, until I spent a few months working telephone tech support and was forced to overcome it.

The only valid excuse for all of the homophone errors you make is that you need to use voice recognition software because of a handicap.  If that is the case, politely mention it in your RTJ and a lot of folks will cut you some slack.  A lot of others won't.  That is their prerogative.  However, that first contact in the form of an RTJ should be the best you can do.
This message was last edited by a moderator, as it was against the forum rules, at 21:10, Tue 15 July 2014.

This message was deleted by a moderator, as it was moot, at 21:11, Tue 15 July 2014.

But if you over came it is it still a disorder? or was it a problem that you overcame.

I myself, have had several issues over my life time that I had to over come. During my youth it wasn't called a disorder is was called 'pay attention', 'don't be lazy' and 'sit at the front of the class room not the back'.

By the way, that's what was told to me, .... not my option.

By todays standards I have several disorders and do very well for myself in RL, and will be 80 and still RPing away with my grandkids, lol.

BUT I do agree,

One of the language disorders (have have like 3 or 4 >.< ) has to do with the fact as a child I had a large part of the underside and tip of my tongue cut off.  This was during the time I was leaning to read. I couldn't speak understandably hardly at all after that but I went into speech therapy and learned to talk normally (mostly some times my r's and w's sound the same... though I think I've completely worked that problem out now, just took much longer)

But something to do with the fact I had to learn to talk again at the same time I was learning to read and write, at the age where your brain forms it's most lasting patterns, gave me multiple crisscrossing pathways (I assume) for a single sound. So my mind has an exstreamly hard time with phonic spelling and homophones.

The there/their/and what not problem I was not even aware of... I am rather glad people pointed it out, It it something I can focus on... try and do my best to remember so when it pops up I can go "HEY!!! wait, did I get that right?" and check, until I can work out the problem and fix it.


And mental disorders you don't overcome and they stop being a disorder. You are stuck with them. You can work at them to get to the point you can function at a normal level but it is still there, you just have worked out lots of little tricks or worked hard to form paterns in your thoughts that work agenst the problem.
This message was last edited by the user at 21:18, Tue 15 July 2014.

I get what you're saying, but ASDs really don't work like that.  I've learned how to interact with others in a normal fashion, but it's never been natural or easy.  If I have to deal with a lot of people in a "normal" setting, it is mentally and physically exhausting for me.  If I'm free to act like myself (typically around fellow gamers), then I have no problem at all.

Someone in one of the threads was talking about how boring a "slice of life" type game concept was to them, but I get it.  Folks that have to work hard at human interaction often have to approach it as a skill rather than a natural thing.  The founder of Facebook, in fact, was like that.  Facebook is a result of his hard work into understanding human interactions.

I'll admit the fact that I've had to put so much work into communication skills has soured me on poor communication from others.  If someone is working on it and clearly doing their best, I salute them.  It may not be something I want to personally deal with in my games, but I salute them for their effort.  Az, part of the reason I've been hard on you is because I originally thought I detected a "well, I have a disorder, it's just the way it is" vibe, which I hate.  My son is pretty far down the spectrum and he uses his disorder as an excuse to be lazy every chance he gets.  I've been working hard to stamp that attitude out of him, but it's like working a Rubik's cube with all the colors peeled off.

Anyway, the flat truth of the matter is that you're going to have people that want to work with you and people that won't.  You'll have all sorts of different people in your life and work.  The most important thing is that you give the absolute best effort that you can, learn what you're doing wrong, and take the steps that you can to correct it.

In light of the recent discussion, I think the whole thrust of the thread makes more sense.  I think you really are working hard to address your challenges, and that is good.

To that end, my suggestion is this.  If you apply to a game and don't get in:

1) If the GM sends you no kind of notice, then consider yourself lucky.  That GM was rude and you may well have saved yourself a headache down the road.  One of the hardest lessons you'll learn is that there really are things you should pass on, even if you like the idea.

2) If the GM replies to you, with no reason (which almost no one will give, aside from being full), then message them back.  Explain to them that you understand that that they're full and you aren't asking for them to reconsider.  Then tell them that you have some social and learning issues and you are working to correct them and would appreciate an honest assessment with what was wrong with your RTJ.  Not everyone will respond, but some will.

I do this.


I don't do this.

Instead, I'll PM some of my GM friends and say something like "I love/hate this RTJ. It reminds me of [character]'s style. Do you know [username]?

I also check the Lost Souls.
This message was last edited by the user at 00:12, Wed 16 July 2014.

That seams to be peoples first assumptions sadly
Oh your just just making that up to be lazy
Oh you are just lazy I you tried you would do fine you disorder can't be that bad
Or that though that no one has any such things and they don't exsist ... Sad thing there are doctors who insist this

But it can be so entertaining when they lie.  :)

Funny story: back in the days when GMs were listed on the Main Menu under their in-game alias, rather than their user name, I once had a player who told me, right at the start of his RtJ, "If you want to see examples of my writing, I play (Character X] in [Game Z], and have done for about five years."  Which was interesting, because I was/still am the GM of [Game Z], and according to the GM Menu, [Character X] is played by a completely different player.

Oh, how I laughed.  I laughed so hard and so long that my wife thought I had become insane... and then I rejected his application without reading any further.  And banned his lying apple pie from the game.

Ah... good times.  :)

Would have been funnier if it was your character. lol

....

That's just tragic.

I don't always create a new writing sample; but I'll do a copy/paste rather than directing them to the game regardless. But stealing writing samples; or lying about who you play...

Gaah. My mind doesn't comprehend.

People not only steal that but they steal peoples characters.

Not only do they steal there characters but they also steal there personas too.

Heck people steal other peoples whole online identity with all that along with it.

Stealing characters is in a different ballpark. ANd just weirder.